Someone finally got a clue...

[blucougar]

I don't think there is anything in this that could be construed as spoilers, but I've put this behind a cut just to be safe. Also, if you don't appreciate comments that don't reflect like diamonds in the sun off Teflon Gwen, then you might prefer not to read on. This is not an anti-Gwen rant, but she does get a mention towards the end, and I can't bring myself to be polite about it.

Rant behind the cut

In the original publicity releases for the new series of Torchwood, the character listing included one Oswald Jones, pedophile. There was, justifiably, a considerable uproar about the inclusion of an unrepentant pseudo-celebrity pedophile character in the plot, and giving such a character the surname of 'Jones'. It seemed the ultimate slap in the face to all Ianto fans.

It also seemed to me that good ol' Rusty was taking his predeliction for the child abuse plot device to worrying new heights. It was especially disturbing that he described the aspect of the show's plot that included this character as 'exciting'. Exciting is one word I will never equate with pedophilia, no matter how it's intended.

Now, however, the character has apparently been changed from being a pedophile to a child killer. No less heinous, but somewhat more palatable than a pedophile. Better still, the name has now apparently been changed from Jones to Danes. Amazing how much difference two little letters can make.

Don't get me wrong. I'm still undecided about how much I'm looking forward to "Miracle Day". I hold grave fears that Captain Jack Harkness will be relegated to being the show's stock-standard 'eye candy', whilst the plot focuses primarily around Bazooka Cooper, the teflon tart of Torchwood. It certainly seems to be what Russell T Davies has been aiming for all along.

I will watch it (when it eventually reaches Australian televisions), but it will be with severe trepidation.

On the bright side, with the exception of Jack, there are no characters left that I have invested in emotionally, and therefore I don't give a rat's arse if the entire cast gets obliterated by the end of the show. Fortunately, my one reason for still watching plays a character who can't die (at least, not until some time after the year Five Billion, apparently).

Unfortunately, the one character that I would very much like to see killed off (because it is LONG overdue) will undoubtedly survive.

Comments

[taffimai]

Are you sure he's no longer a pedophile? My understanding was that he raped and killed children, and is still a pedophile but they've stopped using that as a talking point because the pedophilia is not the point of the show and they kept getting derailed by interviewers when it was a talking point.

Also, they changed the name because "Oswald Jones" failed to clear legal, not out of any sense of obligation to Ianto fans. I can try to find the reference if you like.

(Note: Icon is being used because this is the only one I have on dreamwidth, not out of a desire to be confrontational.)

[blucougar]

I concede over the pedophile bit, but I hope the characterisation has been changed. It was nauseating, reading interviews where RTD was clearly enthusiastic, and described the pedophile sub-plot as 'an exciting story'. I reiterate - 'exciting' and 'pedophile' should never, ever go together in the same conversation.

As far as the surname goes, I'm not fussed whether it was legalities or otherwise that prevented them using 'Jones'. I'm just glad they're not using it.

[blucougar]

(Note: Icon is being used because this is the only one I have on dreamwidth, not out of a desire to be confrontational.)

LOL, your icon is not at all confrontational to me, hon.

Personally, I have no objections to Gwen fans at all. We all have our preferences, and we all have our place to express those preferences. I will always be willing to engage in reasonable conversation. Just as long as they are aware that I am no fan of her, and are prepared to encounter anti-Gwen sentiment on my journal. If they can tolerate that, they are most welcome.

[taffimai]

Sorry, I've had not-great experiences with anti-Gwen people so I thought I'd just explain that it's the only icon I have over here. (Though it's actually a picture of Eve, not Gwen.)

And I appreciate that you put the anti-Gwen sentiments behind a cut so that I could choose whether to read it.

[cyberdigi.livejournal.com]

Just wanted to say AMEN, both to this comment and the post in general.

However I'm sure RTD would try and find a way to kill Jack for good, maybe transfer it to Gwen so she "save the world forever" *twitch*

[blucougar]

Good lord, don't even think it!

Truth is, I wouldn't mind Gwen if she had been willing to behave in accordance with her skills, but she defied Jack right from the start, and keeps on defying him and acting as though she knows more than he does. Case in point: Jonah Bevan and Nikki Bevan. Her determination to go against Jack's warnings and 'help' poor Nikki Bevan only resulted in more grief and despair for everyone involved; something that Jack wanted to avoid.
What really galled me about that episode was that it finished with Gwen pouring her heart out and playing the "poor little me" fiddle to Rhys.

Just once - once! - I would love for Gwen to take responsibility and say, "I made a mistake, and people got hurt/killed, and it's no one's fault but mine".

[cyberdigi.livejournal.com]

Pretty much summed up why I don't like her either...they were so focused on it being all about Gwen and making her "perfect" she became a Mary Sue with little to no consequences (Well that and she's about as green as can be and is somehow second in command). They had several great opportunities to evolve Gwen into a decent character but she just has to be perfect.

[aviv_b_artwork]

And of course the child killer/pedophile will be redeemed by saving the world.

sarcasm alert/
Oddly enough, I keep reading comments from people who are adamant that 'geez, just cause he's a child predator - he can still be good otherwise.' And yet, I've been told by these same folks that one doesn't get cookies for doing the right thing. (I wonder where they hid the child-f'cker saves the world cookie exclusion clause.) And calling Gwen a Teflon Tart (you know already I'm not a supporter of this view) well all I can say is NO COOKIES FOR YOU.

Now, I don't want to upset you, but I have my suspicions as to whether the character who cannot die will actually be alive at the end of the show. Because he's all that stands between Gwen and world domination. Just saying.

[blucougar]

all I can say is NO COOKIES FOR YOU

That's okay - I could do without the cookies at the moment. LOL

I stand by my opinion, though - particularly the 'teflon' part. Because, seriously, nothing ever sticks. All the shit she stirs up seems to hit everyone around her and sticks fast, but it just slides right off her.

It's all a matter of opinion, though.

[aviv_b_artwork]

I'm with you on the teflon part as well. Just not the second part unless we are willing to label male characters like Owen the same way.

[blucougar]

Oh, but I wholeheartedly agree that Owen was a total man-slut. He treated the opposite sex with the same "you're here for my convenience" attitude as Gwen. Even though we're constantly told what an intergalactic man-whore Jack is, the truth is that Gwen and Owen left him in their dust when it came to sex.

[aviv_b_artwork]

And guess who had the most sex - Tosh! Think about it. She got shagged by aliens, Tommy, and Adam. And yet I always think of her as sweet, demure Tosh, LOL.

[blucougar]

True! The difference, though, is that Tosh didn't go looking for it, and didn't manipulate any of her partners into sleeping with her. With the exception of Tommy Brockless, Tosh was the one who was manipulated.

That's why it's easy to continue thinking of her as sweet and demure - because unlike Gwen and Owen, Tosh never flaunted her sexuality. The one time she seemed to be doing that, and making Owen miserable, was when she was under the influence of Adam, and not in her right mind.

[geminia]

Fortunately, my one reason for still watching plays a character who can't die (at least, not until some time after the year Five Billion, apparently).

I know what you mean, though, I don't buy the whole Face of Boe thing, so I figure he was probably still out there even in the year 100 trillion.

I was so thrilled to find a show where I didn't have to worry about my favorite character being killed off for once (I've found being my favorite seemed to be a death sentence in most cases).

Honestly, with the possible exception of Tosh, I never had any emotional attachment to any of the others in the main cast, so they could've killed them all in EW and started with a new team in CoE and I'd have been just fine with it.

That said, I am not happy with the way they have treated Jack for pretty much the entire run of the show, but the things they did to him in CoE were inexcusable, so I really hope he fairs better in this series.

I feel better knowing Jane Espenson and others will be writing some of the episodes rather than it being all RTD this time.

I wish I could believe Gwen's head was on the proverbial chopping block, but I don't see that ever happening unless Eve decides to quit, so I'm hoping Jane and some of the other writers might actually be able to write her in a way that I don't cringe every time I see her (and I do like Eve Myles, so I wish I didn't have to dislike her character so much).

[blucougar]

Mm, I agree with you. One word to the writers - accountability, and not just for Gwen!

The other thing that has me truly worried is the sub-plot with the child killer character. I really worry that we're going to have the "so I killed a kid - so did you, so let's sympathise with each other and be best buddies" shtick shoved in our faces.

I fear this coming series will treat Ianto like he never existed, and the only sort of continuity we'll get carried over from CoE will be to have Jack constantly being reminded that he murdered his own grandson.

[geminia]

I'm really hoping they keep Bill Pullman's character as an all out villain - I don't have a problem with a charismatic villain, just so long as it's clear they ARE a villain in the end. I think Bill could do a wonderful job with that type of role.

I wouldn't mind some acknowledgment of Ianto - like they did with Tosh & Owen in CoE - I just hope they don't have Jack still wallowing in guilt and grief over him and Stephen. I want to see that he remembers them, but is getting on with his [extremely long] life.

I do worry how they'll treat the whole Stephen thing. He did what he had to do - It wasn't a pretty solution and it wasn't something anyone should be forced to do, but at least he didn't take the selfish way out like the politicians and decide to sacrifice other people's children to save his own flesh and blood. Granted, the plot device used to get him to that point was shaky at best, but the character isn't responsible for the writing.

[thraceadams]

I'm glad they changed his name regardless of the reason and I'm glad they are finally downplaying the whole pedophile/child killer whatever part - I thought that was in extreme distaste...but that's just me. I don't plan on watching the show but it will not surprise me in the least if at the end of the day Gwen is alive and with Jack.

just my two cents

[phoebe-and-t.livejournal.com]

First off, I have to admit that I wouldn't be watching even if I had Starz...All the people I liked have been killed off (characters) or fired (actors). There isn't anyone left for me to root for except Rhys and he's pretty much only there to be a Gwen cheerleader or a Jack obstacle.

I have no problem with someone that has killed a person being the hero of a show, a child molester is a whole 'nother thing. Killing can sometimes be explained or even justified...sex with child - not a chance. RTD seems from interviews I've read to be a fairly out-of-touch and extremely self-important individual.